Curse

TopGun · Jun 19, 2005, 01:01 AM // 01:01

As Guild Wars ages and more and more players enter the game, we begin to see a steady shift in the state of economic wealth among individual players. Economic inflation has come about, as is apparent by the rising cost of Sigils being sold between players. How the economy has reached such a mark is debatable, but it is widely accepted that the inflation is in fact created by players, both buying and selling items, who have no idea the worth of items they are selling. A player can still be considered “new” at this game even if they have finished the game and ascended- there are players out there who simply don’t know the worth of their items. Traders have given us a way to establish standard costs for items; We can price dyes and certain sigils according to a Trader’s price. An overpriced item will be picked up on by new players because of the ease of discovering an item’s real value.

Unfortunately, with the vast number of weapons and focus items in the game, players have no real scale in order to determine the value of weaponry. Many MMO style games have suffered this plague in the past; its medication is usually experience. Unfortunately, that isn’t doing the trick anymore, as there are so many valued items their true worth is indeterminable.

For those of you that have played Blizzard’s hit game World of Warcraft, an item-sale system was implemented into the game: The “Auction House.” The auction house allowed a player to put an item up for sale, have all players view it, and allowed the seller to set a starting price and buyout price for that item. Thus, items had traceable values; You couldn’t sell a 20 damage staff for an unreasonable price because a comparable item would be next to it at a far cheaper rate. Thus, selling items became a Capitalistic, competitive manner, many people even used tricks such as pricing an item for “3.99” rather than “4.” Prices were competitive and money had a value.

In order to force prices downward and make the economy more practical, we need to discover similar systems. While an Auction House is an acceptable idea, it too has its flaws- a rich player can buy up lower-priced items, then put them back up at a higher rate and make a profit off of them. What we need to do is discover a system that will force players to price their wares competitively; this will lower the price of items. While one player may attempt to sell that sword for 2 Platinum, another may try selling theirs for 1.5 Platinum; thus, the lower price will sell, and players will need to lower their prices.

A possible solution that has been going around is to allow players to set up their own “Shops.” A player-owned shop system will work similar to the merchants. A player will be able to select a “Shop” item in their Menu list- when this is done, they are stuck in place, and a small counter, cart, weapon rack, or some other indicator will appear in front of them, allowing players to see who has items on sale. Once that is done, the “Shop owner” will be stuck in place and unable to move. A window will appear in the corner of his screen; he will be able to drag-and-drop items from his inventory into that window, and assign a price to all his wares. Other players will be able to come up to him, view his sale window, and purchase his items just like you can purchase an item from a merchant.

Unfortunately, player-owned shops are problems in and of themselves. Location will become an issue; more players will prefer to have their shops at town entrances or by traders because their items will sell faster to arriving players or players looking to shop. Towns and Cities will become very crowded; therefore the Shop System would only be made available in special “Shopping Districts.” A Shopping District will be a special district set aside solely for the purpose of sale and purchase of items via the Shop System.

What we need to do is discover more efficient ways of dealing with inflation; this may be most possible via an easier item sale system. Its time to brainstorm- suggest something, but try to think it through. If it has obvious flaws or issues, mention them, or even better, try to fix them before you suggest it. If you make a suggestion and a poster points out an issue with it, don’t brashly beat his face into the concrete; except his criticism and try to modify your idea, if at all possible. You can debate, but don’t kick each other’s asses over anything.

dbgtboy · Jun 19, 2005, 01:10 AM // 01:10

the shop dist thing is a good idea, whenever you go afk, set up your shop.

Anarchist_Monk · Jun 19, 2005, 01:16 AM // 01:16

Well I think this is a great idea for a money sink. You pay more for a better spot intown and which town you will be in. Say you pay 10k to be in the back of the forge place in souther shiverpeaks(im sorry the name is escaping me right this moment). Then if you want to be located right by the entrance or most popular log in place in that area you pay like 90k or even 100k. People can always make that money back by selling items if they have good items. But a simpler solution would be for Anet to set a price guide. They could get some of their Alpha players to kind of scout out the prices and what they think the prices should be and then actually make that price number when you look at the item a true selling price. But the first idea would be the best, because of the possible money sink. Also an idea would be for guilds to have their own stores. Maybe that would be a possiblity.

Jwh6913 · Jun 19, 2005, 01:30 AM // 01:30

even simpler would be to have a gold wipe

not items or weapons nor armor just gold

the prices would be reasonable again since everybody can't afford 100k for a sigil

Evan The Cursed · Jun 19, 2005, 01:35 AM // 01:35

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jwh6913

the prices would be reasonable again since everybody can't afford 100k for a sigil

Except three days after the wipe, they'd be back to 100k.

Ryoushi · Jun 19, 2005, 02:04 AM // 02:04

This is an AWESOME idea. AFK+shop=rock.

Xellos · Jun 19, 2005, 02:17 AM // 02:17

The problem comes from insertion of cash into the system while the cash sink is too small and avoidable most of the time. Players only profit, and that doesn't work in any economic system. The games PVE was flawed to begin with, the easiest thing would've been to concentrate PVE to support PVP until you stabilized PVP. Then work on PVE. Of course, it's Anet's decision with what to do, but it'd be wise if they can figure out how to at least make a decent economic system, less they want to bring back stone of jordans.

Holoman · Jun 19, 2005, 02:24 AM // 02:24

Everquest has the player merchant method for dealing with buying and selling among players. Basically when you enter the selling district you can call up a window and enter the item that you are looking for. Once you found the item that you are looking for, just click on the find trader button and you would be directed to face the seller. Eventually, you would be able to find the seller by clicking on the button several times to redirect you as you run toward that trader.
http://www.rpgexpert.com/everquest/bazaar2.jpg
This is a picture of the interface and I think it was a great implementation.

Jwh6913 · Jun 19, 2005, 02:30 AM // 02:30

Quote:

Originally Posted by Evan The Cursed

Except three days after the wipe, they'd be back to 100k.

not necessarly- anet nerfed the farming spots, and most of the gold came before they nerfed the drops in major farming zones.

Anarchist_Monk · Jun 19, 2005, 02:36 AM // 02:36

Yeah but there are still farming zones, you may just not know about them. And I'm not about to tell everyone that doesn't know because thent hey will be abused again and those taken away.

Jwh6913 · Jun 19, 2005, 02:43 AM // 02:43

and I bet those zones are usually places where nobody bothers to go like the reed bog, or snakedance, or twin lakes, etc?

and it doesn't matter, anet has logs for EVERYTHING- overall zone drops as in how often rares drop, and how many runed salvage items, Xp gains, people in the zpecfic zone, their activities, etc. I'm sure they already know about the "secret farming zones" but they don't bother to nerf them yet, until they finish implementing their changes to the item/rare/rune drop system.

TopGun · Jun 19, 2005, 03:15 AM // 03:15

Guys, a Gold Wipe is out of the question. While the economical state of the game is a current issue, it is not in a state so severe as to warrant the elimination of all player funds. Not only that, but the players who got rich in a respectable fashion will gather together and cause quite a stir on forums, fansites, and all other mediums which ANet inspects regularly- and keep in mind those people are ANet's big customers, fans so devoted to the game that they'll buy any expansion without question. ANet doesn't want to loose those customers. Not only that, but ANet would suffer from severe public backlash as a result of such a wipe. Its far too drastic.

ManadartheHealer · Jun 19, 2005, 03:22 AM // 03:22

If they were to have a gold wipe, the day before the wipe I would buy all the items/materials/weapons/etc. my money could nuy (and blow the rest on ale

), then they wipe the gold, I wait for prices to stabalize, and I am fine

Quote:

Originally Posted by Holoman

http://www.rpgexpert.com/everquest/bazaar2.jpg
This is a picture of the interface and I think it was a great implementation.

Something like that would be nice

If they truly wanted to increase the value gold, they would charge a tax (daily) for leaving gold (not items) into the storage account. Someone could not have more than 100k without paying taxes on it. That way, poor newbs don't get shafted but all these people with 1000k gold will start to lose some.

theclam · Jun 19, 2005, 03:52 AM // 03:52

I think WoW's Auction House is the best way to facilitate buying and selling.

Realistically, Guild Wars doesn't need something like this. Basically every item in the game can be bought from a Trader, for a relatively fair market price, except for Weapons, Shields, Foci, Upgrade Items, and Collector Items.

Also, I don't really know why people complain so much about high prices. You can get good armor and weapons from collectors, for about 15-30 minutes of grinding each. The only things that can't be found readily and sell for exhorbitant prices are Sigils and Runes. Sigils are easy to buy, with money pooled from your guild. The only runes that aren't cheap are certain Superiors, which don't even offer a large advantage over Majors or Minors. So why are people complaining so much? Without any support from my guild, I already have 35k, after playing for 80 hours, and have every single item that I want or need, with the exception of a good staff head, a good wand, and a Superior Vigor rune. If I looked around, I could probably find the staff head and the wand. The only thing that I want that I can't easily get would be the Superior Vigor Rune, which only adds a small benefit over a Major.

What's the big deal? Why are high prices such a bad thing?

Jwh6913 · Jun 19, 2005, 03:56 AM // 03:56

well, as what you said, theclam, is true, but the problem is people wants everything good, and that creates proce gougers, and that creates inflation. it's actually cheaper to buy a sup rune of absorption or vigor through the trader than paying 100k for one.
and guess who the main price gougers are? yep the farmers that farmed a lot before the nerf

TopGun · Jun 19, 2005, 04:02 AM // 04:02

When you say Collectors, do you mean Weapon crafters? Those weapons are poor- AT BEST. They aren't even purple weaponry- that doesn't quite fly with me. I'd like to carry a blade a little better than that. And I've sold even MINOR runes for prices so ridiculously inflated it would make you sick...

Moofoo Pork · Jun 19, 2005, 04:07 AM // 04:07

Quote:

Originally Posted by theclam

What's the big deal? Why are high prices such a bad thing?

I just saw a axe get sold for 1,250,000 g and a sup vigor (or something like that)... just ridiculous, something has to be done.

Jwh6913 · Jun 19, 2005, 04:09 AM // 04:09

Quote:

Originally Posted by Moofoo Pork

I just saw a axe get sold for 1,250,000 g and a sup vigor (or something like that)... just ridiculous, something has to be done.

omg I agree. Gold wipe would solve the problem in a big way- or that person just got scammed out of 999 plats and 3 characters worth of 300,000 gold

King of Fools · Jun 19, 2005, 04:15 AM // 04:15

bleh. gold is worthless. just because it has a lot of zeroes doesn't mean you are paying a lot for something.

Jwh6913 · Jun 19, 2005, 04:31 AM // 04:31

do you ever recall a time where you struggled to buy something because you didn't have enough gold? that's what we're talking about

the current new players and nonfamers vs the pure hardcore farmers/ price gougers is all it comes down to right now.